Talk:Kaneko Lumi

Trivia Section
If you have a problem with the trivia, discuss it here. Simply considering it too long isn't a real issue. Stuck in the Christmas Box (talk) 18:18, 10 April 2023 (UTC)

Both stop edit-waring. Wiki should be facts, not opinion. Cmodo98 (talk)
 * Give me an example of an opinion posted. This is all stuff Lumi has said on stream. Stuck in the Christmas Box (talk) 18:30, 10 April 2023 (UTC)

Guys: one of your trivia was "She might have ... or not ...". Are imagining this plateform as a sandbox or a theory forum? Taon (talk) 18:32, 10 April 2023 (UTC)
 * Ctrl-f-ing "She might" on the old page literally brings up 0 results. What are you talking about. Please use actual examples. Stuck in the Christmas Box (talk) 18:41, 10 April 2023 (UTC)

Bargaining case by case in vain will lead you nowhere. Since the beginning of the discussion, all you do is just earning time. Just stop, you are making her page dirty. Taon (talk) 18:54, 10 April 2023 (UTC)
 * You are the one making up quotes. It seems you want important trivia. Trivia by definition is of little importance. It being too long is not a reason for you to batch remove trivia you don't care for. Please as a sign of good faith provide a real quote, a real example that shows the problem you have with this trivia. Stuck in the Christmas Box (talk) 18:59, 10 April 2023 (UTC)
 * STOP EDIT WARING IMMEDIATELY! The case has been reported to wiki administrators Sebastian The Archivist (talk) 19:12, 10 April 2023 (UTC)
 * You can add ~ at the end to sign. Stuck in the Christmas Box (talk) 19:08, 10 April 2023 (UTC)
 * Noted Sebastian The Archivist (talk) 19:12, 10 April 2023 (UTC)


 * [[User:Stuck in the Christmas Box| Ok I'm off work so let me bring you up to speed to what's been going on on Lumi's wiki, Talon has been removing legit entries which is the nice way of saying censuring the wiki by unknown (I assume subjective) criteria as you have no doubt noticed, breaking a whole bunch of rules in the process, as well as going against the wishes of Lumi's community and Lumi herself, they have also kept moving the goalpost, first they stated they did not break any rules, once they have realized they "might have" broken "some" rules they proclaimed that trivia section is making Lumi uncomfortable therefore it's unwelcome, which is pretty funny since they by their own admission do not follow or watch Lumi. The goalpost has been moved once again when I proved that to be completely wrong https://clips.twitch.tv/AltruisticSplendidSquidRalpherZ-VS8BuMLar77q0sK8 and they replied with classic "Who do you think you are for considering I am in ignorance of Fandom rules? You are there since a week. "Collaborative project" doesn't translate into "a group of newbies coming out of nowhere can suddenly rule over a page and make a mess of its shaping." line (ironically that's exactly what they are doing) and they have accused me of breaking the rules because I assume I have dared to challenge them and reverted the site to the state before they censured it, which is somehow braking the rules. They claim to have done this to make the site more readable, but again censoring it's against the rules and it goes both against Lumi's and community's wishes. only thing I can conclude after trying to reason with them in this thread https://virtualyoutuber.fandom.com/wiki/Message_Wall:Taon?threadId=4400000000000065258#4400000000000495283 is that they are doing this to stroke their own ego and assert their dominance.

So what to do? let's just leave the site be for now as edit waring doesn't help anyone, they have been reported and once the case goes thru the queue and decision is made the site will either be reverted to last good state which is my last edit so all the edits after it will be lost, or it will be left alone, in either case it doesn't make sense to edit it now. Sebastian The Archivist (talk) 03:52, 11 April 2023 (UTC)

Don't rise yourself like a hero against a tyran and accept we will not let any more parasite content get through. Taon (talk) 05:55, 11 April 2023 (UTC)


 * Short Update; the page is locked (editing functions disabled), and the case is currently under review Sebastian The Archivist (talk) 13:16, 11 April 2023 (UTC)


 * Who is "we"? What does parasitic mean in a trivia section on a wiki? You have been unclear on what you dislike about the trivia besides it makes the page "dirty" and it being not important enough, which by definition trivia is not important. Your quotes are made up afaik going through the edit history I could not find one ctrl-f of anyone of your quotes, "She might have", "She is blond", "She talks about herself", "She is human", "She likes talking about fashion". So I ask again, please use a real quote of a problem trivia you have. I read your discussion on your message wall. I say as a reminder, it doesn't matter how long you been here or how many pages you edited. You and an account made 1 day ago are of the same importance. Stuck in the Christmas Box (talk) 13:23, 11 April 2023 (UTC)
 * While I have not found anything close to "she might have," "she is blond," "she talks about herself," etc., I did find some trivia facts which I think are weird. All excerpts are from here.

My only reasoning for these is that, as I once said before, they are far too detailed for an average reader. It may be cool to see those underground only true fans will know this facts recognized by the wiki, but it doesn't do any good for those people who want to know about this VTuber and are hearing about them for the first time. It's too overwhelming. And as you may have guessed, I'm part of the people who don't really watch this particular VTuber but are interested in learning about her. It's debatable whether we should have this much trivia about Lumi's parents.
 * Her grandmother is an actress.
 * She thinks fast food tastes bad.
 * Lumi refers to her real life father as "daddy" which tends to cause confusion among newer fans.
 * Lumi hates NTR, her favorite tags are Corruption and Vanilla.
 * Lumi's family is from the north and they were well off, but then communism happened.
 * Lumi's mother is accomplished scientist and gifted painter, Lumi has shared a few of her mother's paintings on stream: "my mom is a true genius", despite this her mother has poor social skills.
 * Lumi buys men's cloths on ebay.
 * Lumi hates fidgeting noises.
 * Lumi wants to go to Austria.
 * Lumi is fond of reptiles and considers them cute.
 * Lumi used to draw a lot but fell out of the passion when she mismanaged commissions such as offering free revisions.
 * Lumi names a parakeet Snowy.

Below are facts which I think would be more fitting for the "Personality" section:
 * Lumi is "people pleaser" who loves taking care of others.
 * Lumi used to draw a lot but fell out of the passion when she mismanaged commissions such as offering free revisions.
 * Lumi will visit cat cafes even though she is somewhat allergic to cats.

Below are facts that I think are too cryptic and would be better if rephrased:
 * Lumi uses the "*" for push to talk.

As for the others, I don't know, it's too much... By the way, it seemed weird to me that most of these facts don't have references in them. How would I know if these are actual facts and not something someone made up? U.ayaao.p  about  17:46, 11 April 2023 (UTC)
 * You don't find quotes that are close, you find quotes that are same words. That's what quotes are, especially if someone used "literally" before the quote. If not, it is a made up quote that I will point out the ridiculousness of. You can think they're weird but are you saying that is reason to remove them? If not, I don't see your point. People can simply not read trivia if they are not looking for trivia. It is the second last section in the page excluding references. I don't think you get to speak for the avg reader. If you want to learn about her then the trivia is a neat section. Personality: besides "people pleaser" I don't see how the rest fit in personality. They can tell something about her personality but don't fit there. Rephrase it to "Lumi uses the "*" button for push to talk in voice communications programs and games." References: Most of the trivial in phase connect don't have references and I assume most of this entire vtuber wiki. If a mod wants to agree to trivia needing references but it won't be removed that's fine by me. Clips can easily be made. But I doubt that's the actual problem you have. Also, the ones with references were also removed by taon if I read Sebastians comment correctly. Do you actually think any of these weren't said by Lumi herself on stream? My guess is I can go to 90% of the wiki pages, demand the trivia be removed because it has no reference, and the only thing accomplished will be me being an ass. There are plenty of vtuber wikis that have long trivia sections, some you might be familiar with, such as pikamee and selen. I do not see why this one is the one that needs to be trimmed. Stuck in the Christmas Box (talk) 18:22, 11 April 2023 (UTC)

I said it for what feels like 100th time but I'll reiterate again, User:U.ayaao.p read the spirit of Wikipedia(wiki spirit article), rules, code of conduct, and formatting guidelines of Wikipedia because fandom wikis do need to adhere to those, as well as rules, code of conduct, and guidelines of Fandom, even though I'm aware you won't read any of them let alone follow them, but you could at least respect the cardinal rule of the wiki "wiki should be completely and absolutely objective with neutral tone, subjective entries or subjective removal (censoring) of entries are strictly forbidden" and "I did find some trivia facts which I think are weird." sure does sound like an subjective opinion, you don't get to decide what value some facts have like in an example of shampoo you listed, as someone might as well care about that and try said shampoo out. Also some of the facts you listed where on the page since it's creation because lumi stated them in her debut stream and neither you nor taon where bothered by them till now, not to mention Taon removed entries with references attached to them, isn't that curious... it's almost like you care about your own reputation and self asserted position of authority more than the wikis. You also stated that I've broken the rules but you did not list any examples nor rules I've supposedly broken, and no undoing censorship does not break the rules. On the other hand encouraging other users to break the rules is pretty serous breach of code of conduct, like you did in above linked thread where you encouraged Taon to keep censuring the wiki in subjective way. As a side note you guys are excellent at gaslighting as you kept moving the goalpost in the thread to hide your real objective and wasted my time in the process, at first it was not against the rules to censure the wiki, than the wiki was making lumi feel uncomfortable which is pretty funny, only after I've posted the clip https://clips.twitch.tv/AltruisticSplendidSquidRalpherZ-VS8BuMLar77q0sK8 did your true objective come out "Who do you think you are for considering I am in ignorance of Fandom rules? You are there since a week. "Collaborative project" doesn't translate into "a group of newbies coming out of nowhere can suddenly  rule over a page  and make a mess of its shaping." so that's where we are. Considering all that may I suggest spending your time on something that would suit you better, like getting into politics, you would be amazing at it. Sebastian The Archivist (talk) 18:35, 11 April 2023 (UTC)
 * Okay okay I get it. It was foolish of me to even enter this argument without knowing the wiki spirit, rules, code of conduct, and formating guidelines of Wikipedia. I'm not trying to rule over a page though. I'm just saying what I find weird about this page as a reader, and maybe that thought itself was wrong, because the wikis are supposed to be a community project. U.ayaao.p  about  18:49, 11 April 2023 (UTC)


 * Disclaimer: I do not watch Lumi at all. Taking in consideration of everything that has been happening. While there is no limit to how big a section can be, as our Contribution Guideline states to "Refrain from posting any information about their activities outside vtubing, and anything from their past lives before becoming vtubers, such as personal relations, jobs, activities...no matter if they themselves mention it". Content should pertain to their VTuber persona and anything beyond that can be removed. Strictly speaking, in technicality yes, the rules/spirit of the wiki were broken (on both sides). We should also not be attacking anyone for their based experience whether you be seasoned editor or those who just joined us. This is just my take on the situation, and I should have stepped in earlier before it got out of hand. MCPopFan (talk)